The largest school of thought, although maybe not a majority, contends that the largest, most powerful handgun that you can shoot rapidly and accurately is the only defensible choice. 10mm Auto and .44 Magnum (in double action revolvers) are frequently mentioned although there are devotees of even more energetic chamberings.
Another school of thought is to abandon handguns and use a sling so that you are always attached to your rifle. Their thinking is that a stout 10mm Auto load might have 10 grains of powder and a stout .44 Magnum might have 20 grains. Those both pale when compared to an anemic rifle chambering like 30-30 (30 grains of powder with a barrel that is three times longer than most handguns) and are dwarfed by .308 Win with 45 grains of powder.
A third school of thought is that you don't have to stop the the bear or out-run it, you merely have to outrun your fishing buddy. Continuing with that thought, it is only necessary to shoot your buddy in the leg with a small caliber handgun. In fact, if you shot him with a powerful handgun, he might drop to the ground and stop moving in which case the bear will leap over him and continue to chase you.
My take on the subject is that most people overlook the fact that bears have a very difficult time using pistols with trigger-guards. This is not unique to bears. Anybody who has used pistols in extremely cold climates knows that trigger-guards and gloves don't always play together well. If the goal is to arm bears, then then need weapons that do not have trigger-guards.
When viewed from this perspective, the only logical choice regarding the best handguns for bears are the micro-revolvers manufactured by North American Arms.
All joking aside
Handguns can be difficult to shoot accurately. The rifle/sling option has much to recommend it.
For the most part, bears' behaviors are predictable since they need to consume 20,000 Calories a day to build up body-weight to survive hibernation through the winter. Minute-by-minute they will be in the location that favors the most rapid acquisition of calories per minute. Frankly, even in most of Alaska, you are at more risk from humans than from bears.
Nope.
ReplyDeleteI still support the right to arm bears.
Intriguing points, I had never considered the ergonomics of the actual bear the will use the firearm. Perhaps an M72 law would be better fir the bear, as there are no trigger guards and only a large push switch.
ReplyDeleteI have one of those .22 ice picks from NAA. It stays in the safe. Bears don't need help from me.
ReplyDeleteYes....two legged predators are a much bigger risk than members of the Ursus species. However if you do frequent their favorite locations it's best to carry something substantial. For Black bears a handgun of sufficient caliber is probably adequate. For anything larger a long gun is recommended. And 30-30 is probably not enough. I would recommend 45-70 or similar.
ReplyDeleteIt is ironic that when the 30-30 came out it was considered a death-ray for big bears compared to the blackpowder cartridge rounds in general use.
DeleteMuch has changed since then. In general, the lead alloys used to make bullets is harder and most bullets are jacketed. Guns are stronger and run higher pressures, so today's 45-70 isn't the same as your great Grandpappy's 45-70.
But until about 1920 when our WWI doughboys returned from the trenches of France and started using the 30-06 on game, the 30-30 Winchester firing 170 grain bullets at 1900fps was considered to be awesome in every way for everything up to the biggest Grizzly Bears.
Maybe a 12 gage, with slugs... lots of slugs.
ReplyDeleteThe challenge with the shotgun is the wait for proper range. You fire right as it runs you over.
DeleteWhatever you choose, it needs to put the bear down every time a round hits. Bears have a tendency to not realize they are dead for several minutes. Having them spend that time standing back up allows them to come to terms with their demise before they cause yours.
Bears need to load up 20,000 calories per day. You are at least 20,000 calories.
ReplyDeleteI'm mister inexperience here, but I've read tons of first hand experiences. My choice's for defending me and mine would be a 12 ga. with 3 inch slugs. Next would be a 308 AR. My choices are limited to on hand hardware.
ReplyDeleteTypically, you don't get much warning with a bear charge.
An analysis came out awhile back that compared all the officially recorded handgun bear charge stops in Alaska. Statistically, 9mm was close to big bore handguns in stopping bear charges. Speculation was that 10-15, 9mm rounds, were as good as a few big bore rounds.
Every chance I get, I'll avoid free range bears.
Even walking my mellow Tennessee, woods (a stump farm, logged off 30 years ago) I take at least an AR pistol for protecting my dogs and me from coyotes, big cats or 2 legged predators, but not Sasquatches. Never shoot a Sasquatch just because they're scary.
They have rules to live by. If they are scaring you, YOU are in the wrong place, leave now. If one is actually attacking you, only shoot it in the head, a lot! They will persecute you if you unjustly hurt or kill one. They accept and understand ones need for real self defence. They have multi dimensional senses and abilities, just because you live 500 miles away is no guarantee of getting away (unless you're in the MIDDLE of a large city). They do incursions into suburbia.
Many have gone down that road (12 gauge slug).
DeleteMany have had cause to rethink it after skinning out bears killed by shotguns.
There is no free lunch. A wide wound channel comes at the expense of less penetration.
There are two ways to stop a mammal RIGHT NOW!!!
One is to break major structural bones like hips, femurs, shoulder knuckles. The other way is to hit major branches or nodes of the Central Nervous System.
The garden variety Foster slug you can purchase from Walmart is soft lead that splatters when it hits major structural bones. It also is severely limited in how deeply it penetrates.
Buckshot bounces off of skulls.
Most of the Bin dar Doondats no longer carry shotguns for big bears.
I was going to comment about our local Black Bears but after reading Tree Mikes comment...
ReplyDeleteI be speechless.
Corb Lund has a song call the grizzly blues. Here are some lyrics - Should I run or should I stand?
ReplyDeleteIt's an old debate
'Cause sometimes it's a bluff charge
And then, sometimes it ain't
Can they run downhill?
Can they climb a tree?
Maybe that's just black bears
I can't remember, hmm, let's see
Should I shut up or should I shout?
And maybe try to scare 'em off
Well, pretty much most anything I do'll just piss 'em off
In the end, it don't matter
What you choose to do, of course
When 800 pounds of grizzly bear
Outruns a quarter horse
A few considerations when choosing a weapon for shooting bears. The world record brown bear was killed by a native lady with .22 longs with several head shots. She didn’t have a choice an knew where to hit it. What ever you choose use a bullet that provides penetration. I understand you can buy hard cast bullets for the 9mm and I saw a write up of a guide using this load on a grizzly. I load my 44mag with 270 gr Hornady bullets that were designed for the 444marlin. I have never had to use it but one time with my Marlin 44mag carbine I killed two caribou with one shot. If I knew I had to shoot a bear I would carry thr .444marlin! So penetration is important and breaking bones gives you time for a follow up shot. I knew a guide who was telling about a grizzly that he and his client shot nine times with a .300.win mag and a.270 and it finally dropped at ten yards. The first shot was at 100 yards and no major bones were hit! Another guy at the camp verified that it was a true story!
ReplyDeleteI don't think bears NEED handguns... God gave them teeth and claws for a reason!
ReplyDeleteJonathan