Saturday, November 7, 2026

From the comments: When you get visitors who expect charity

From the comments: I’m checking stock to make sure I have more of whatever. Also had thoughts what do we do if he/she/they show up expecting us to help or take them in. Who do you turn away? Can’t help everyone.

You are the Chief Executive (along with your spouse) of your domain. Who you "hire" and who you "fire" is a key role of management.

In a factory, the role of management is to ensure the smooth, efficient and economical operation of the enterprise by minimizing waste and maximizing the production of the highest-value products within the constraints of the facility and inputs. Management's role is to create harmony.

For starters, turn away quarrelsome people. Not just for your benefit but for the benefit of everybody who you extend the privilege of being your guests. Figuring out who is quarrelsome is not rocket-science. They announce themselves. They demand.

Proverbs 21:9 "It is better to dwell in a corner of the housetop than in a mansion with a quarrelsome woman" but let's be honest here, men can be every bit as quarrelsome as women. People who hold on to grudges and who argue until the other party submits destroy harmony. 

Don't let them in the door, even if they are your child. They might be "good" for a short period but will regress to their true nature. People regress to their ingrained behaviors that they are most comfortable with when they are stressed. They are EXTREMELY unlikely to embrace discomfort and rise to the needs of austere living.
 
People who stir-the-pot are destroyers of harmony and value their own power and status more than the success of the group. People who raise legitimate questions are not stirring-the-pot but ask the question to ensure they don't fail the organization.

Turn away people with a history of gossiping. Loose lips sink ships...and destroy cohesiveness. It isn't that "you hate them", it is that your life-boat cannot afford to have them on the premises. You are not acting as a person. You are acting in the role of Chief Executive (or Captain) of the life-boat.

With respect to neighbors and tools..."You asked to borrow my chainsaw. The deal is that if I loan out my chainsaw then I also loan-out my labor running it. You get me AND my chainsaw." At that point, you might start dickering about what three hours of your time + chainsaw are worth. If you don't have firewood, you might do it on shares. If you don't have a bicycle but the neighbor has extras, it might get you a bicycle. If you are running short of gasoline, maybe you can siphon five gallons out of the old lady's Suburu.

Courtesy of Google: Grocery stores in Kent County, Michigan. It is 23 miles as-the-crow-flies from the upper-right corner to the closest major grocery store.
Contrary to what you will read in fiction, most refugees will flee to the cities, that is, to where the "services" are. They will be camping (sleeping in their cars) in the Kroger's and Walmart parking lots long before they think to show up at your front door. If government intervenes (and they will because they cannot resist) they will inject "help" through the largest, existing infrastructure, and that won't be through Frank's Party Store in the middle of BF nowhere.

People who shop every day (even if it is buying a coffee or a bagel) or get two Grub-hub deliveries a day cannot imagine living eight miles from a store and having to walk or ride a bike to get there.

Throw in the fact that power and internet are likely to be more intermittent in the boonies than in the city and things will have to be totally Mad Max before your little bit of heaven is attractive to most people. 

During famines in India, people leave the countryside and go to the big cities looking for work.

During the ending days of WWII, people stayed in Berlin until the Soviets were within just a few miles of the city limits.

So, my gut-feel is that almost all of the people you DON'T want as "guests" will self-select to stay away from your life-boat (especially if you have the foresight to turn off the internet router during the daylight hours when they are most likely to show up).

The power of language

I need a better word than "guest". The word "guest" implies hospitality and the life-boat can only afford about three days per person of hospitality. After than, the relationship has to change. The person who is living on your property must become a value-producing part of the domestic ecosystem. They have to earn their keep.

I am open to suggestions regarding a better noun than "guest". 

30 comments:

  1. Partner. Team mate. Investor.

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    1. "Partner" suggests that they have the authority to vote-in a new management team. That sets up the possibility of a hostile take-over.

      I was thinking more along the lines of "apprentice" or "probationary member". If they don't like it, they can shop for better management by walking away.

      The better managers will hand out responsibilities in natural-and-logical chunks and delegate as much authority as the member earned. Management/coaching ability is a limiting resource and it is a waste to micromanage the exact length bolts of wood are cut for the fireplace (for instance).

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    2. There already is a name for these people: refugee. They could also be called asylum seekers.

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  2. For the record, the Cumberland Saga is fiction that starts from the perspective of a young man running away from his past and becoming accepted by a very strict, very old-fashioned religious group; some would call it a cult. The reasons for the young man's precipitous flight is never given because that is not important.

    http://eatonrapidsjoe.blogspot.com/2023/09/disappearing.html

    The community, on the other hand, must deal with the stress of more refugees and make adaptations.

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  3. Unfortunately, some guest/s may be family related. Could be an issue. May less so, if they are distant family. Same for distant friends and acquaintances.
    I like the term ‘associate’. Maybe ‘hired hand’.
    Southern NH

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    1. You might take an inventory of your resources and figure out exactly how many people you can safely house for 18 months. Then when things go pear-shaped, reach-out to the family members who you know will be an asset and fill those slots.

      Then you can tell the grasshoppers when they show up "We are full." Don't give them details regarding the time horizon you planned for because they will use it to argue.

      Think about how you can guide events rather than be passive targets when things speed up.

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  4. I’m thinking that visitors will need to add to the supplies, I.e., don’t come empty handed. Tell them they will need to work, as directed.
    Those with lack of skills, or health / age issues will be a problem.
    SNH

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    1. exactly. Pooling resources is one thing:
      Showing up with nothing and expecting charity (and freebies) because they couldn't prepare is another.

      The first is the "Guest" you want.
      The other,....not so much.

      My rule is that if you show up empty handed (unless you are a refugee because of a disaster (Earthquake, fire, enemy attack) that destroyed your home) you will be handed 2 days worth of calories for each member of your party and then shown the door. Told that if they return they will be considered a threat and treated accordingly.

      Yes, this creates enemies, but it also keeps leaches and laziness and lack of forethought from your compound.

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    2. Well, let's talk about this.

      Suppose we were to sit down and write out a list of what they need to show up with. Basically, a "ticket for entry". Let's say we are talking about a family group of two adults and two kids in grade-school.

      Bedding for four including sheets and quilts
      Foam pads or folding cots for mattresses
      Pillows
      Clothing, work, trousers and shirts two each
      Clothing, cold weather
      Rain-gear
      Aprons
      Footwear, boots
      Footwear, regular
      Footwear, slippers or crocks
      Underwear, seven pair each
      Seeds
      Six laying hens
      Fencing
      1800W of solar panels and converters to change to AC power
      Chicken feed, 600 pounds
      One shotgun and one .22 rifle
      Books, games and decks of cards for entertainment
      Fishing equipment (maybe)
      Etc.

      The next thought is "They will have to pre-position those supplies. No way can they find it when the balloon goes up and then transport it 200 miles."

      OK, what are the odds that your kids/nieces and siblings will send you money to give them a ticket on the life-boat. Yes, it would be super handy to have somebody contribute to planting the orchard that they might need ten years later (when it would actually be bearing), but if their thought processes worked that way they would be doing those things now.

      All of that said, every miracle that Jesus performed had some contribution from the person who gained by the miracle. A few fish and loaves, some stone urns filled with water, a tug on the hem of his cloak.

      The major value of "the ticket" is that it demonstrates good-will.

      The only miracle that I recall that did not have some contribution from the receiver was Saul getting knocked off of his horse. And that might be the kind of miracle that the grasshopper needs most.

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    3. I was thinking of dry goods, ammo, some clothes, gloves, maybe tools. In John Wesley Rawls book Patriots, I think one person showed with a bicycle with panniers and small trailer. He brought what he could manage. Being young and healthy and willing to work made him an asset to the group.
      SNH

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    4. I am with anonymous above:
      Show up with SOMETHING. Show some moxie, some level of forethought and preparedness. It need not n=be prepositioned. Some food, some water, some defense, some tools to gain more food,
      Not just a "Grasshopper", but rather a displaced Ant.

      Don't just be a refugee, be someone with whom I would want to pool resources and labor with.
      We all gotta sleep, and one person can't do many tasks alone.
      Having said that, there are many people who would show up that I would not let my guard down near, and whom would not be an asset to the group. What they show up with, and how, would demonstrate that.

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  5. Like Southern NH I was also thinking associate, one of my associates died suddenly yesterday, I spent the evening texting and talking to people I haven't heard from in ten years. We all have that same appointment.

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  6. Does "subsistence worker" sound accurate ? A person's labor provided in exchange for limited food - water. Where the worker occupies their off time is dependent on permission from the property owner.

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  7. The term “prospect” would work if you’re giving them a chance to prove themselves. The 1%-ers are fond of it.

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  8. There is turned away and there is turned away with extreme prejudice. If threats are made against my family or tribe it goes to extreme prejudice extremely quickly.

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  9. Two thoughts to add the conversation:

    1) It is easier and cheaper in the long run to feed a refugee than to shoot him. Lawyers and such. As a downward spiral develops one might spend a hundred dollars at the grocery store to get a waterproof bin of one pound bags of beans and one pound bags of rice. Give one each of these to refugees who are not prospects for adding to your platoon and tell them that there won't be any more --- move on and good luck. This also addresses the moral problem of having, for instance, a lone woman walking up your driveway shepherding 3 or 4 children. I ain't gonna drive them off with a shotgun but I also am not going to split up hard-limited resources for them.

    2) I read a sad tale told by a European mercenary soldier on contract to one side of civil war in some shithole African country. This was in the 1960s when Africa was worse than normal, which is pretty bad even now. The war had caused huge refugee movements. The mercenary's advice was simple and unblinking: DO NOT become a refugee. Flee to the woods, flee to the mountains but do not become a wandering stranger in someone else's land. There was no mercy for any locusts and refugee camps, if they even existed, were little centers of hell. That would be, centers of hell ...in Africa. I leave you to imagine what that would be like.

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    1. "2)" is a reference to the book 'Kondotierzy' by Polish mercenary Rafał Gan-Ganowicz.

      He is most famous for his reply to a snotty journalist's question "How did it feel to take a human life". His reply: "I wouldn't know, I've only killed communists.”

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    2. Agreed. I have a planned place to go if things get really bad, and considerable supplies to bring along.

      I don't want to be dependent on others charity.

      My lightly populated VERY rural county is storing food for the entire community for a year - it's an ambitious project!
      Jonathan

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  10. Joe an interesting thread.

    Now turn it around. You come back from working and wife is outside your burning house.

    What's your plan?

    I have pre-positioned supplies and a welcome at a trusted friend. THEY have pre-positioned supplies and a welcome at my place.

    Also, a suggestion to any additions to your tribe after things get weird. MEDICAL ISOLATION.

    A simple garden shed or tent structure with a cattle panel fence around it. Folks even BEST BUDDIES that showed up invited get a 2 week visit there.

    WHY? Ever get that "I wanna DIE flu"?

    If they were travelling through the failed water-septic craziness situation they MIGHT just be carrying a BUG, you don't want across the whole Team.

    If they are healthy, after that Isolation, awesome welcome home. If sick, you can keep your team healthy while treating them until they recover.

    Medical Isolation is also useful for that sympathy mommy with kids' scenario. BOTH for the sickness she and her kids might bring around AND for BETRAYAL if she's a plant for a local gang who wants her to UNLOCK your defenses some dark night.

    Few thug females can keep up a "mommy" act with strangers' kids for long. Something will be "wrong" about it. OR the Gang will be awaiting the signal and eating up supplies and water wondering if She betrayed them.

    Logistics, it's a thing. Gang Leadership requires providing the gang with enough food, safe water and plunder or a leadership change is likely.

    I'm not looking forward to the troubles I've seen in Bosnia, but they are coming.

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  11. Isolation will run them off, along with demands that they 'help' with whatever you need.

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  12. I would take my sister in I'm responsible for her , she is ten years older than me,but her mentality is maybe that of a 12-15 year old. She is70 . I would take her resources with us . Other family members no . I would help neighbors and yes I believe it would be a community each helping

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  13. The key is to make it perfectly clear long before any such "need" arises that you and yours are NOT the place to show up at for succor and aid. And you must be willing...and ABLE...to enforce that edict should need arise. The world has no shortage of parasites who will happily drag you down to an early and miserable death. So decide early on who is part of your group, prepare accordingly and then prepare to repel all others by whatever means required. This admonition includes all the local political parasites who will decide when need arises that YOUR preparations are fair game for THEM to seize.

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  14. Where we live in road system rural Alaska I think most people who might become refugees would hang out in a Walmart parking lot in Anchorage or MatSu before heading our way except children, grandchildren and great grands know they are welcome but living 400 miles away might seem easier to deal with problems unless violence gets bad. One problem we might have is if things look really bad we need to watch out during salmon run in the copper River as we are on the major access road to dip net salmon in a famous subsistence location. Some might range off the main road looking for food to steal! Whatever?

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    1. Even in rural Michigan, people have been known to steal cut-and-seasoned firewood. In your case, that would also be bad.

      Don't leave it on a trailer or sled or you will lose both.

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  15. My question is, why do you want to die with me, when you could live longer by yourself?
    sam

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  16. Live where the food is grown in an area that rarely sees snow. Have a house with a fireplace that has one way in to get to and multiple hidden ways out. Grow a year round garden. Have a long term (10 day on max use and 40 days minimum use) generator backup before refuel. Have a hand pump well as backup and run a septic tank. Split weapons and ammo between house and external workshop.

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